#53 - Joe Jackowski and Nick Buegel: Meaning, Power and Virtue

“Thinking capacity gets sacrificed on the altar of empathy. “

Joe Jackowski

Joe Jackowski and Nick Buegel return to the show. Joe is currently in the beginning stages of his thesis, where he is diving deep in the psychology of meaning where our conversation starts. At this point, we meander through history, picking at ideology and power using the Nazis, Hitler, and Operation Paperclip as examples. We then connect back to a more personal scale on how our beliefs and upbringing affect ourselves and those around us. We close with thoughts on power, responsibility, and leadership.

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Show Notes:

[00:03:21 - Breakfast Intro 

[00:05:01] - Animals and Brutality of Nature. Life can go lights out in snap of the fingers

[00:06:51] - Running a Simulation Experiment

[00:08:51] - Fortress Theme Park Thought

[00:10:29] - We don't have a frame of reference if you have experienced it yourself.

[00:12:01] - Everyone has their own fall - In reference to Eden

[00:14:01] - Psychological Literature on Meaning

[00:15:01] - Popping the Bubble and Connecting to Parenting Styles

[00:18:16] - Reality is Social there are Human Obstacles

[00:19:41] - How Ideology Changes: Looking at Operation Paperclip (Book Link)

[00:23:46] - Bringing in Nazi Scientists to the US and then giving them positions of power to infuse the culture with their ideology

[00:25:14] - Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl

[00:26:57] - It is impossible to point at an individual from any group and be able to pass a generalization

[00:30:11] - Love, Death and Robots (Netflix) 

[00:30:46] - In hindsight, Operation Paperclip looks like an episode of Blackmirror from a Moral and Ethical view point.

[00:32:31] - Technology is not inherently evil, no matter the background of the creator

[00:33:11] - Fritz Haber: Haber - Bosch Process and Zyklon B

[00:34:36] - Hitler's Framework: He used a pesticide.

[00:36:46] - Dan Carlin's: Blueprint to Armageddon

[00:38:42] - When people assume your view when you look the same as they do.

[00:40:36] - Nick Buegel's experience with someone sharing their racist viewpoint as a captive audience.

[00:43:01] - A question of power - How do you make sure people in power have good frameworks?

[00:43:51] - The Power Trip in the Military

[00:46:00] - Sam Harris Vox Interview "I need you to turn up the empathy dial."

[00:48:05] - Every value has an extreme - the middle ground is where the virtue lies.

[00:49:46] - Sometimes someone who is self categorizes as an empath is just very agreeable.

[00:51:51] - Nick Buegel framing a break up in better light than from the other perspective.

[00:53:44] - Joe Rogan on the Jordan Peterson Podcast - Talking about breakups and putting the pieces back together.(Part 1 & Part 2)

[00:54:51] - As a parent, putting frameworks (mental tools) to help rebuild. Attachments to the mother and father. 

[01:00:31] - Example of needing a distribution of roles in parenting: Good Cop, Bad Cop

[01:02:33] - Synchronizing your thoughts, works and actions

[01:03:36] - Change from wish to do. Be what you want to become. 

[01:05:27] - Epigenetics and Pig to Boar Example

[01:08:51] - Evolution and People in Space

[01:11:51] - Matt Damon takes over space

[01:13:33] - Back to Military Promotion and Power

[01:18:06] - Power and Responsibility

[01:19:38] - The Lucifer Effect by Philip Zimbardo